Comments on: Equality Bill: equal pay http://www.lynnefeatherstone.org/2009/06/equality-bill-equal-pay.htm Liberal Democrat MP for Hornsey and Wood Green Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:43:43 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Majority of public think men are paid more than women for doing equal jobs | Mark Pack http://www.lynnefeatherstone.org/2009/06/equality-bill-equal-pay.htm/comment-page-1#comment-2550 Majority of public think men are paid more than women for doing equal jobs | Mark Pack Wed, 02 Dec 2009 21:40:39 +0000 http://localhost/wp28/?p=2267#comment-2550 [...] Parliament. Lynne Featherstone (the party’s Equalities spokesperson) has been arguing for much tougher action than the weak audit proposals being put forward by the Government – though without success so [...] [...] Parliament. Lynne Featherstone (the party’s Equalities spokesperson) has been arguing for much tougher action than the weak audit proposals being put forward by the Government – though without success so [...]

]]> By: Majority of public think men and paid more than women for doing equal jobs http://www.lynnefeatherstone.org/2009/06/equality-bill-equal-pay.htm/comment-page-1#comment-2542 Majority of public think men and paid more than women for doing equal jobs Tue, 01 Dec 2009 09:43:08 +0000 http://localhost/wp28/?p=2267#comment-2542 [...] Parliament. Lynne Featherstone (the party’s Equalities spokesperson) has been arguing for much tougher action than the weak audit proposals being put forward by the Government – though without success so [...] [...] Parliament. Lynne Featherstone (the party’s Equalities spokesperson) has been arguing for much tougher action than the weak audit proposals being put forward by the Government – though without success so [...]

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.lynnefeatherstone.org/2009/06/equality-bill-equal-pay.htm/comment-page-1#comment-2068 Anonymous Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:07:39 +0000 http://localhost/wp28/?p=2267#comment-2068 "Yes women also suffer pay wise for their caring and child bearing responsibilities - but there is still a major part of the pay gap laid directly at discrimination door. Work done wholly by women and part time work, which women take because of their caring responsibilities - are incredibly poorly paid"<br /><br />I've no idea what you're trying to say here. Seems to be exactly the point I made - i.e. undemanding, part time work which lots of people want to do (women, students, semi retired people etc etc) is easy and therefore very popular thus market forces result in lower pay for such jobs due to supply and demand. Whereas dangerous and demanding jobs where one has to travel long distances and work unsociable long unflexible hours attract a premium. So what?<br /><br />I'm not seeking to attack you - I attack misinformation regardless fo who happens to post it. I perhaps should have given credit for you not having a post as inaccurate as we would have got from a number of Labour politicians. For example at least you didn't try to use the ridiculous 23% pay gap figure that Harman manages to use while keeping a straight face. Also I think the comparator issue you raised is also legitimate.<br /><br />However "17% less for equal work"? Sorry but I find that hard to believe - I certainly don't know of any data proving that. Yes some studies put the pay gap at 17% but certainly not for equal work - it's for all work - i.e. anything at all. What's your source please Lynne?<br /><br />Also in an article such as this I think Iw oudl have been a good idea to actually name and shame those paying people less for exactly the same job solely because of their gender - afterall you went after Cambridge without anything being proved so why not actually expose all the sexist councils out there who were in the news this week and actually WANT to pay people less for EXACTLY the same job due to their gender? "Yes women also suffer pay wise for their caring and child bearing responsibilities - but there is still a major part of the pay gap laid directly at discrimination door. Work done wholly by women and part time work, which women take because of their caring responsibilities - are incredibly poorly paid"

I've no idea what you're trying to say here. Seems to be exactly the point I made - i.e. undemanding, part time work which lots of people want to do (women, students, semi retired people etc etc) is easy and therefore very popular thus market forces result in lower pay for such jobs due to supply and demand. Whereas dangerous and demanding jobs where one has to travel long distances and work unsociable long unflexible hours attract a premium. So what?

I'm not seeking to attack you - I attack misinformation regardless fo who happens to post it. I perhaps should have given credit for you not having a post as inaccurate as we would have got from a number of Labour politicians. For example at least you didn't try to use the ridiculous 23% pay gap figure that Harman manages to use while keeping a straight face. Also I think the comparator issue you raised is also legitimate.

However "17% less for equal work"? Sorry but I find that hard to believe - I certainly don't know of any data proving that. Yes some studies put the pay gap at 17% but certainly not for equal work - it's for all work - i.e. anything at all. What's your source please Lynne?

Also in an article such as this I think Iw oudl have been a good idea to actually name and shame those paying people less for exactly the same job solely because of their gender - afterall you went after Cambridge without anything being proved so why not actually expose all the sexist councils out there who were in the news this week and actually WANT to pay people less for EXACTLY the same job due to their gender?

]]> By: Lynne Featherstone MP http://www.lynnefeatherstone.org/2009/06/equality-bill-equal-pay.htm/comment-page-1#comment-2067 Lynne Featherstone MP Mon, 29 Jun 2009 07:11:51 +0000 http://localhost/wp28/?p=2267#comment-2067 Typical non-factual response from anonymous. And when are you going to have the balls to put your name to your post? You are wrong on figures but more importantly you are simply putting the Tory line that discimination is not a major part of the pay gap - other reasons are. Dissected in Bill committee this Tory argument did not hold water. Yes women also suffer pay wise for their caring and child bearing responsibilities - but there is still a major part of the pay gap laid directly at discrimination door. Work done wholly by women and part time work, which women take because of their caring responsibilities - are incredibly poorly paid. ANonymous - you are clearly happier attacking me than facing the reality of inequality in pay and would rather do nothing to tackle unequal pay and continue women's poverty regardless of the facts. Read Hansard for full debate and enlighten yourself. Typical non-factual response from anonymous. And when are you going to have the balls to put your name to your post? You are wrong on figures but more importantly you are simply putting the Tory line that discimination is not a major part of the pay gap - other reasons are. Dissected in Bill committee this Tory argument did not hold water. Yes women also suffer pay wise for their caring and child bearing responsibilities - but there is still a major part of the pay gap laid directly at discrimination door. Work done wholly by women and part time work, which women take because of their caring responsibilities - are incredibly poorly paid. ANonymous - you are clearly happier attacking me than facing the reality of inequality in pay and would rather do nothing to tackle unequal pay and continue women's poverty regardless of the facts. Read Hansard for full debate and enlighten yourself.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.lynnefeatherstone.org/2009/06/equality-bill-equal-pay.htm/comment-page-1#comment-2066 Anonymous Mon, 29 Jun 2009 05:34:27 +0000 http://localhost/wp28/?p=2267#comment-2066 Once again complete and utter nonsense form Lynne on this issue:<br /><br />"women are still paid 17% less then men for equal work - we are sick of waiting."<br /><br />The recognised official figure for the pay gap is 12.8%. Yet even that has absolutely nothing to do with equal work - it is just the difference in full time earnings. As most people know men tend to be more experienced, work longer hours, work full time, overtime etc, etc.<br /><br />""Traditionally these 'women's' jobs have been paid poorly as women's work has always born the stigma of not being as important as men's work and consequently is paid at a lower rate."<br /><br />Once again compete hogwash. The main reason many male dominated jobs are more highly paid is because the work is more physically demanding, less popular as it is far less pleasant and usually far more dangerous.<br /><br />Women work in jobs which have flexible hours, require less travel and are less demanding - Many more people want such jobs and thus due to market forces the rates of pay go down. Thsi is supply and demand - the fundamental basis of the economy. It has nothing to do with sexism or discrimination whatsoever.<br /><br />The Health and safety executive reports that in 2006/7 five women died as a result of work related injuries. This compares to 173 men.<br /><br />Thus, this indicates male dominated jobs generally have 35 times more risk of death than female roles. If such men are paid 17% or 12% well who cares. they're well worth every penny and if anything I'd say they should get even more!<br /><br />For Lynne to fail to acknowledge such obvious reasons for pay gaps is quite frankly insulting to all those men (and the smaller but not insignificant numeber of women) who genuinely put their lives and health at risk every single day just to pay the bills. Once again complete and utter nonsense form Lynne on this issue:

"women are still paid 17% less then men for equal work - we are sick of waiting."

The recognised official figure for the pay gap is 12.8%. Yet even that has absolutely nothing to do with equal work - it is just the difference in full time earnings. As most people know men tend to be more experienced, work longer hours, work full time, overtime etc, etc.

""Traditionally these 'women's' jobs have been paid poorly as women's work has always born the stigma of not being as important as men's work and consequently is paid at a lower rate."

Once again compete hogwash. The main reason many male dominated jobs are more highly paid is because the work is more physically demanding, less popular as it is far less pleasant and usually far more dangerous.

Women work in jobs which have flexible hours, require less travel and are less demanding - Many more people want such jobs and thus due to market forces the rates of pay go down. Thsi is supply and demand - the fundamental basis of the economy. It has nothing to do with sexism or discrimination whatsoever.

The Health and safety executive reports that in 2006/7 five women died as a result of work related injuries. This compares to 173 men.

Thus, this indicates male dominated jobs generally have 35 times more risk of death than female roles. If such men are paid 17% or 12% well who cares. they're well worth every penny and if anything I'd say they should get even more!

For Lynne to fail to acknowledge such obvious reasons for pay gaps is quite frankly insulting to all those men (and the smaller but not insignificant numeber of women) who genuinely put their lives and health at risk every single day just to pay the bills.

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